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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Feb 24, 2010 - 09:27pm PT
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And why is that such an issue when the commies are telling THEMSELVES what they want?
Is that what you think that link was?
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Feb 24, 2010 - 09:28pm PT
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The commies are coming, the commies are coming... QUACK, QUACK!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 24, 2010 - 09:31pm PT
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Gary they're still using the same playbook...
that's pretty funny, Locker.
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Binks
Social climber
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Feb 24, 2010 - 10:46pm PT
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Not only are communist phantoms plaguing you so are "progressive", "green", and "leftist". Honestly how many people so you know that belong to a "progressive", "green", or "leftist" organization so much so that they qualify for demonization under these supposed communist agendas you are editorializing about? I don't know any one who identifies themselves this way. Am I "green" because I compost and bought some CFC bulbs? Am I a communist because I don't really give a crap about traditional family structures? I'm a fiscal conservative but I haven't seen many of them in government lately. I know a guy who works for the Sierra club. I guess that's getting close on those lists. The list you posted from the Frankfurt school listed "Excessive drinking". I mean, geez. Excessive drinker. Must be a communist. These categories are so broad that anybody could be accused, and that, my friend is the real point. This sh#t is batshit crazy.
What you are proposing qualifies as conspiracy theory. These pundits are preying for any enemy to materialize. If they gain power, it will be to start a war. Gotta have an enemy. Even if the only thing they can pin is "excessive drinking". I'm exaggerating -but only a little. The same reason why this stuff if facetious is the same reason the Tea Bag movement can't go anywhere. It has no real target.
Honestly, Blue, WTF do you really care about? Heaven forbid it should be something one someone's communist watch list. Nothing like being branded as being part of some vast conspiracy just for having a differing opinion on some hot button issue.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Feb 24, 2010 - 10:49pm PT
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"Excessive drinking"?
Oh, oh. McCarthy was a drunk! We're doomed! Doomed!
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Feb 24, 2010 - 11:13pm PT
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”It is likely that true communists in the USA are as rare as wolves in Idaho, or grizzly bears in California. A fantasy bogeyman.”
Hi Anders…… Often, I can hear wolves howling from my cabin. But I’m more worried about a Ted Kaczynski coming through the door.
Wolf populations? Idaho, about 850….Wyoming, under300….Montana, 550.
Do communists hanging out in Sproul Plaza howl ?
Sorry for the diversion……. with Rox on leave, I feel compelled to guard the flocks......hmmm, about twenty-four in this wolf
pack.
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Captain...or Skully
Social climber
Last clip of Lichen Lunch
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Feb 24, 2010 - 11:15pm PT
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I'm a commie wolf lover....So what?
Bring it.
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samg
Trad climber
SLC
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:11am PT
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Cleon Skousen's muckraking is one of the main reasons why many Mormons branched away from the church in the 80's and 90's and formed polygamist cults. Kind of a long story and a real shame. Not sure how Glen Beck has managed to overlook that when he quotes Skousen.
Also here is a fun quote about fascism and socialism:
"Fascism is the complete opposite of socialism"
Benito Mussolini, from 'What is Fascism.'
Simple as that.
One thing you have to remember about real Communists is that their intent is the dissolution of the State completely, rather than erecting a totalitarian super-State. Socialism is just a tool for them, to wrest power from the ruling classes, after which the State would be dispensed with.
If you read the FBI files on Albert Einstein, you'll see that Einstein himself was accused of plotting to overthrow the State or specifically, the US Government, because of of his ties to leftist political groups. Since the Cold War and since the totalitarian abuses of supposed Communist governments have been thoroughly aired out, this is a theme you don't hear in anti-Communist propaganda any more.
So it would be wrong to equate Communists with Socialists, and even more wrong to equate them with Fascists.
(Fascism is a political "third way" btw, and contains elements of both the political left and the right)
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Srbphoto
Trad climber
Kennewick wa
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:29am PT
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It is not wrong to equate Communism and Socialism if Communists are using Socialism as a step in their goal. They are using the State to achieve their goal even if the goal is no State.
There also would still be a State under Communism, otherwise you are discussing anarchy. The people would constitute the State. Who would decide on rules? Utopian Communism is basically democracy without a profit motive. But what happens if I vote against the majority and refuse to comply? There would have to be a mechanism of enforcement - the State.
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Captain...or Skully
Social climber
Under the Macabre Roof
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:32am PT
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Naw, we'd just pelt you with rocks......And then build cairns with them.
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John Moosie
climber
Beautiful California
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:39am PT
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In my defensse, however, look at the stated goals of communists and look at leftist policy and progressives in this country.
Yep, Clinton was a commie. He worked towards balancing the budget. To be a good capitalist you must belong to the republican party and spend spend spend.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Elk Creek, Idaho
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:49am PT
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The LDS church publically distanced itself from Skousen and his writings.
Respected BYU history professor Louis C. Midgley accused Skousen of "inventing fantastic ideas and making inferences that go far beyond the bounds of honest commentary."
SLC mayor H Bracken Lee said after firing Skousen as chief of police;
"The man is a master of half-truths. In at least three instances I have proven him to be a liar. He is a very dangerous man [and] one of the greatest spenders of public funds of anyone who ever served in any capacity in Salt Lake City government."
Early LDS leaders such as Joseph Smith and Brigham Young preached the “United Order”, a form of socialism. Many Mormons embraced capitalist concepts but the “United Order” is believed, by adherents to fundamental LDS doctrine to be the final condition in economic evolution. Communism and European socialism are seen as counterfeit systems.
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Srbphoto
Trad climber
Kennewick wa
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Feb 25, 2010 - 12:54am PT
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Naw, we'd just pelt you with rocks......And then build cairns with them.
Try it and I'll put you down with my Big Wall, Smith & Wesson 45 cal "Astroman Special"
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Feb 25, 2010 - 01:55am PT
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Do you love wolves that are commies or are you a commie who loves wolves?
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Mimi
climber
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:05am PT
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"Naw, we'd just pelt you with rocks......And then build cairns with them."
A stoning, a stoning. I'm all for a good old fashioned stoning!
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Wayno
Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:08am PT
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I'm already stoned.
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Mimi
climber
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:11am PT
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Wayno, whatever happened to the funny tinfoil hat party or something like that?
We'er overdue for a gathering.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:14am PT
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with Rox on leave, I feel compelled to guard the flocks
In case you missed it, he's back. A few tentative posts on Tuesday, almost a dozen today, and who knows what tomorrow's total might be.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:19am PT
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We'er overdue for a gathering.
Hi Mimi. The gathering is coming. Wayne and I have been talking about it. Food. Communists. Beer. Wolves. Gonna be great.
Maybe late March or early April?
Is Steve back? Haven't seen him here on ST lately.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Feb 25, 2010 - 02:19am PT
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The LDS church publically distanced itself from Skousen and his writings.
Just as they have from polygamy - but in reality there's never enough distance between LDS and the inevitable cults and spinoffs it spawns from it's authentic heritage and legacy. I know and have spent time with Joel Skousen (bought the Wind Chapel in Hood River from him). There is much to like about the Skousens as a family apart from their politics and the businesses they copromote with them. And they have a following for a reason and the LDS had and has a significant role in that regardless of their press releases and several decades of working hard at mainstreaming.
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